Your favorite dragon about endpolls

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Your favorite dragon about endpolls

Post by Hydre(Hydreigon) on Thu Mar 17, 2016 11:58 am

I lied about the title.

There are cooler dragons ;w;

Anyway. Hello everyone, Hydre speaking here about something that we love, we hate, just like... you got it. Endpolls.

Endpolls have gone a LONG way from what they used to be (shoutout to Lux for the bot), but there are still a few things that are grinding my (and not only me) people's gear.

First of, saltpolls.

What's a saltpoll? An endpoll happening and asked by someone who just died/got destroyed/removed from a RP by the host/natural reasons, and because this person cannot RP as he could before, decides to ask to end the RP. You'll tell me, "But Hydre, if more than 55% people vote 'yes', then they would all want to end the RP, you suck!!!!1!!'. And to that, I'll say : tauros-crap. Having an endpoll reminds people not RPing that they COULD. It also usually generates a shitton OOC, more than there is usually, leading to less RPing, and people arriving in the room WILL vote yes on that poll. I think you got my point.

Second of, endpolls 'for fun'.

Yes, I know the staff is working REALLY hard to make the room a better place (and this is without irony. I mean it.) But sometimes, polls are just not justified whatsoever, and happens, because hey why not? I know some of the staff usually ask for the endpoller's reason to do so, but as far as I know, it's not the general rule. Yes, I'm not a staff, and I shouldn't have a say in this, but when you're RPing and someone gets in the chat bragging 'Hey guys, Imma endpoll this because it's fun', it can really make people upset. Upset people can act stupidly. You got it.

Lastly, endpolls because of the host/rp.

I was a culprit of this, I know. Got over it. The thing is, endpolling because someone is hosting/something is being hosted, and not because what is being hosted is meh can make things really randomly messy, leading to anger, leading to chaos, shitpost, bashing and worse if needed. We all hate when a specific RP runs, but you can near always wait it out for the next RP. What's a few hours, after all? Bar the 'infinite' RPs like Kingdom/etc, RPs WILL end. That goes with my 2nd point, asking for a reason to end, be it OOC overdose, poor hosting/interaction with RPers.

Thanks for reading. Opinions below, etc.

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Re: Your favorite dragon about endpolls

Post by Rico on Thu Mar 17, 2016 3:19 pm

Staff will generally ask "Why?" when people ask for an endpoll. The issues you listed are exactly why, however it's a fine line. If people aren't having fun in an RP then it's entirely within their right to ask for an endpoll. A conquest that's been going for 2 hours doesn't really leave itself open to the same kind of new players as another RP. A Murder Mystery is closed to new players once it gets in to the swing of things. You might just not like what's being played. These are all legitimate reasons to ask for an endpoll, because the room is all about people enjoying themselves. We use a weighted majority vote (55% end) because we do think RPs should continue if there's some disagreement, but as the room is built around the idea of the users deciding what we do and for how long, if the majority think it should end, then yes "I don't like this kind of RP" is fine. At the same time, we have restrictions to make sure that RPs do get a chance to shine. Endpolls will VERY rarely fire in the first thirty minutes, and there's usually a thirty minute grace AFTER an endpoll fails during which an RP can continue without fear. Based on the data I collected previously out of 78 RPs only 8 ended under 50 minutes, another 5 before the first hour. That's a pretty long time! The average RP ran a total of 1 hour and 50 minutes.

Having talked about ones we do accept, I will say that I have personally told staff to ignore any user I catch doing polls for fun, adding them to a list of people not allowed to request endpolls. Similarly, if we spot somebody trying to endpoll purely because they lost or don't like the person running it, we will do our best to put a stop to it. Unfortunately that's not always easy, especially if we're only online to staff the room and not actively participate in it (we have other things to do after all). We try our best, but if you notice specific users consistently causing problems like that be sure to let us know, preferably with screenshots, logs or date/time (as the Globals in our room can check room logs as well).


Hopefully that cleared things up a bit?
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Re: Your favorite dragon about endpolls

Post by Hydre(Hydreigon) on Thu Mar 17, 2016 4:02 pm

Rico wrote:Staff will generally ask "Why?" when people ask for an endpoll. The issues you listed are exactly why, however it's a fine line. If people aren't having fun in an RP then it's entirely within their right to ask for an endpoll. A conquest that's been going for 2 hours doesn't really leave itself open to the same kind of new players as another RP. A Murder Mystery is closed to new players once it gets in to the swing of things. You might just not like what's being played. These are all legitimate reasons to ask for an endpoll, because the room is all about people enjoying themselves. We use a weighted majority vote (55% end) because we do think RPs should continue if there's some disagreement, but as the room is built around the idea of the users deciding what we do and for how long, if the majority think it should end, then yes "I don't like this kind of RP" is fine. At the same time, we have restrictions to make sure that RPs do get a chance to shine. Endpolls will VERY rarely fire in the first thirty minutes, and there's usually a thirty minute grace AFTER an endpoll fails during which an RP can continue without fear. Based on the data I collected previously out of 78 RPs only 8 ended under 50 minutes, another 5 before the first hour. That's a pretty long time! The average RP ran a total of 1 hour and 50 minutes.

Having talked about ones we do accept, I will say that I have personally told staff to ignore any user I catch doing polls for fun, adding them to a list of people not allowed to request endpolls. Similarly, if we spot somebody trying to endpoll purely because they lost or don't like the person running it, we will do our best to put a stop to it. Unfortunately that's not always easy, especially if we're only online to staff the room and not actively participate in it (we have other things to do after all). We try our best, but if you notice specific users consistently causing problems like that be sure to let us know, preferably with screenshots, logs or date/time (as the Globals in our room can check room logs as well).


Hopefully that cleared things up a bit?

That did, yeah. It is just really tiring and repetitive to see RPs always endpolled by the end, and while I know that staff doesn't have time to check carefully each doc, ending a RP after a certain moment inside is pretty meh. I've been thinking if something like, having 3-4 kingdoms left in CQ, 3-4 people alive in a MM, elite 4 in a trainer, or 'endboss' in PMD/DnD would have a sort of .nearendrp command, that when inputted, prevents an endpoll from being made for the 30 mins following, kinda like having a 'fake' endpoll to let the RP continue, but if it takes too much time while ending, an endpoll could happen? idk.

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Re: Your favorite dragon about endpolls

Post by Allyson(Ninetales) on Thu Mar 17, 2016 9:52 pm

Hydre(Hydreigon) wrote:
That did, yeah. It is just really tiring and repetitive to see RPs always endpolled by the end, and while I know that staff doesn't have time to check carefully each doc, ending a RP after a certain moment inside is pretty meh. I've been thinking if something like, having 3-4 kingdoms left in CQ, 3-4 people alive in a MM, elite 4 in a trainer, or 'endboss' in PMD/DnD would have a sort of .nearendrp command, that when inputted, prevents an endpoll from being made for the 30 mins following, kinda like having a 'fake' endpoll to let the RP continue, but if it takes too much time while ending, an endpoll could happen? idk.
I support this idea, but wouldn't that be too complex? Here let me propose something similar: (This takes place for a Conquest that is about to end)
*Endpoller PMs staff*
Endpoller Bot: Hey Moderator, can you do an end rp poll?
Moderator: Why?
Endpoller Bot: I just don't like this RP, I also want FR already D:
*Moderator PMs host*
Moderator: Hey, what part of RP is it now?
Host: It's about to end, we'll just wait the final battle
Moderator: Okay thanks
*Moderator PMs Endpoller*
Moderator: Sorry but you can't request an end rp poll right now because the RP is about to end, just hang on for a little while they're just waiting for the final battle.

From the scenario above, that is effective but it's kinda troublesome so I also have an alternative:(This takes place for a Conquest that is about to end)
*Endpoller PMs Staff*
Endpoller Bot: Hey Moderator, can you do an end rp poll?
Moderator: Why?
Endpoller Bot: I just don't like this RP, I also want FR already D:
*Mod checks the doc and sees that the Conquest only has 2 Kingdoms left*
Moderator: Sorry but you can't request an end rp poll right now because the RP is about to end, just hang on for a little while

The second one would be ineffective if the docs are like DnD, PMD, Trainer and such so I think the first one is better.
So the two are both effective ways that are less complicated than adding another bot command.
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Re: Your favorite dragon about endpolls

Post by Rico on Thu Mar 17, 2016 10:58 pm

While I appreciate that idea, Conquest currently has an average run time of about two and a half hours with a median (the middle time) of just under 3. Without the rules you're proposing, Conquest ran a total of 25% of the 143 hours I recorded, and that was when Prom was free to run immediately after Freeroam.

What I'm saying is I'm not convinced this is as big of a problem as you may be implying. I will say that we do try to avoid ending RPs if they're going to end shortly anyway, but we're only human and while it does sound great to ask a host, RP users tragically aren't always reliable, so that's not really a reliable source for us.
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Re: Your favorite dragon about endpolls

Post by Hydre(Hydreigon) on Fri Mar 18, 2016 7:06 pm

Thanks for the complete answer, which is actually well structured x)

As you said in your reply, people can't always be trusted, but this was just a suggestion thrown in to make that small problem non existant. Having a RP endpolled near the end by someone just being impatient or wanting to be a prick always make people angry.

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