A Post-Mortem of Prom and Saving PokeHigh: Why Do These RPs Have Stigmas?

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A Post-Mortem of Prom and Saving PokeHigh: Why Do These RPs Have Stigmas?

Post by Psychoreality on Sat Sep 03, 2016 10:46 am

Prom is dead. PokeHigh is dying. These are facts at this point, and we all know it. However, while Prom is truly gone forever, we need to take what made Prom die and maybe extract a "cure" for the same problems that are plaguing PokeHigh, because what is there is not a bad concept. While an RP about school sounds boring, Harry Potter is huge, and there are at least 100 school anime that turn a profit each year. There's plenty of potential.
A Post-Mortem of Prom
Prom in early 2015 was already showing signs of caving. The punch-spiking meme was at its peak with Lux and Penny having constant wars over that damn punch bowl. Shipping was literally the only purpose of it. Even then, 80% of people saw Prom as a "wasted FR". This comes down to the setting and the stigma. The setting of Prom was bad. Let's face it. Being confined to an average school gym limited the interactions possible by a LOT. There was no fighting, which may be a good thing, but of course people don't know that you should have come to Prom with a date, so they all played Mr. Steal Your Girl all RP. All. RP. I once played as an entirely aromantic OC for a Prom and still got hit on. Several times. Because of the poor setting, it also gained a stigma which perpetuated the shitpost and poor use of the possibilities for a Prom. However, let's face it... Prom was pretty much just FR with no fighting in a small space. Boring. This is why Prom died; not because of the shitpost, but because, as a seperate entity from Freeroam that in turn voided Freeroam, it hurt the room because of how overcentralising FR is. Prom did nothing unique except limit the potential of the roleplayers.
What Should We Learn?
Well, the most important thing to learn is that setting is what determines a successful RP. Harry Potter's Hogwarts is a magical school with so much space to explore, and a LOT to do with it. That's interesting. A bog-standard high school with nothing cool or unique is not. Hell, even the most boring and shitty school anime have one unique thing about the school (see: The Shit Anime War [T/N: The Asterisk War]) to differentiate itself. At the moment, too many PokeHighs don't. Back when I didn't know any better I hosted PokeHigh with a table to prove how damn easy it was to host. However, in a time where the RP's potential is dying, we need to actually put effort into world building. Hosting it takes no skill. Zero. What defines a PokeHigh host is how interesting their school is. At least, that's how it should be in my opinion. But of course, the people of this world do not all think like I do.
How To Kill The Stigma
PokeHigh has a stigma for a reason. It's easy for roleplayers to pick apart and destroy a function and cohesive world in this kind of RP because, as I said earlier, hosting it requires no skill, so people over and over prove it by being absolutely terrible at maintaining their participants. The only PokeHighs I remember keeping this world together well through punishment are Rocket Admin Lens's Boot Camp where you got super punished for being an idiot, and Marshall De Vos's PokeHigh where you were liable to expulsion for breaking the rules too much. This SHOULD be the norm, which would fix the horrible shitposty nature of 90%+ of PokeHighs. However, I suppose this isn't too bad since it can just cause more stupid drama than it solves. What I'm trying to get across is that people in PokeHighs act too much like shit-headed teenagers who don't want to learn. They should be punished accordingly. Not too harshly but if people derail your RP too hard, as the host you can kick them out. A lot of hosts (including myself, let's be real) do kick people out for trying to "win" or destroy an RP that they spent a long time making. Don't let people undermine a world you spent a lot of time making.
Conclusion
To conclude, I don't know whether I want to see PokeHigh do a Prom or come back stronger than ever. I'm gathering your metaphorical Dragon Balls right here for you. Make your choice. Shall we fix it or let it go for good?
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Re: A Post-Mortem of Prom and Saving PokeHigh: Why Do These RPs Have Stigmas?

Post by Ryan Fitzmagic on Sat Sep 03, 2016 11:18 am

When I first started in the rp room Pokehigh was actually one of my favorite rps. However, this was only because I lucked out and there was a fantastic host of that rp who kept it interesting thoroughly interesting throughout the whole rp. It didn't take very long to learn that this was a very rare thing for Pokehighs. As time goes on this problem seems to only get worse. Just keeping statistics on my own Pokehigh I've come up with this...

12 of 13 times I hosted Pokehigh in January 2016 were successful

1 of 5 times I've hosted Pokehigh after that pertained the same level of success.

Now I could have just gotten worse at hosting since I did it a lot less, but on the assumption that I didn't, it just shows the situation deteriorating further. There are some Pokehighs I seen that if you were to remove all of the shitposting, you would barely have any rp at all. I think another major reason for this that wasn't touched on is the teachers. There are a lot of teachers who do the following that just worsen the quality of the rp.

•Take 5-10 minutes after they are called upon to start the class.

•Ignore students that are actually trying to roll properly

•Participate in the shitpost themselves because their friends are doing it

It is very hard to deal with this issue though, as you don't know what a teacher is going to be like until they start teaching, and by then it is usually to late to get a new one.

As a teacher, one should probably:

•Have what they want to say prepared so they don't slow down the rp.

•Interact with the students who are trying to rp properly

•Ignore the shitposting users who are throwing bricks at them or anything of the likeness

In my opinion, Pokehigh is fixable, but it would take a hell of a lot to do it, and if we don't have the amount of people we need wanting to fix it we are probably better off letting it die.
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Re: A Post-Mortem of Prom and Saving PokeHigh: Why Do These RPs Have Stigmas?

Post by Rico on Sat Sep 03, 2016 6:46 pm

I've talked some about Pokehigh and my position on it is generally fairly clear. I would not support removing pokehigh, as it brings something that is not easily replicated in another RP. The issue it faces is purely host driven, something we would normally allow the users to sort out for themselves as this is technically their domain. We don't pick your hosts, we leave that to you.


I'm going to drop a bit of advice here for the 3 people who've gotten this far in to the thread.

1. Don't give out teacher roles. I realise this is part of every pokehigh, but that is why Pokehigh is a failing RP. You want that RP to show any degree of consistence then it must be the host who runs these classes.

2. If you give out teacher roles, understand that these are your CO-HOSTS. They have just as much, if not more, say in what goes on during your RP as you do. This means you should never just give out teacher roles as a first come first serve thing, that's a recipe for disaster.


If you can follow and understand these two points, I guarantee you will see an improvement in the quality of pokehighs across the board. Anything after that is just a matter of hosting style and such. You can run math/english/science classes if you like, or you can do Berry/Battling/Humans if you'd rather. That's all on you, you do what you will have the most fun.


As a quick follow up, it has been on my to do list to make this a recommended change in pokehigh. What this means is that it will be part of the 'official' pokehigh doc and suggested by the bot whenever pokehigh is set, but it won't be a required change like the host requirement for cruise. Unfortunately, I've been a bit busy so this isn't quite there yet, but it's definitely a plan.
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Re: A Post-Mortem of Prom and Saving PokeHigh: Why Do These RPs Have Stigmas?

Post by Endurr on Sat Sep 03, 2016 10:25 pm

PokeHigh does have potential, because unlike Prom, you're not confined to a single place! (the school gym or wherever it was held at) Hell, you could have a school in the sky or you could all be fishes (geddit, school of fishes? lol xd) However, It does take almost no skill to host and as you've all seen: shitposters take it apart.

The main thing is how to combat the problem. What is the problem? Shitposters, right? Not really. While they are PART of the problem, there's many things to it. The host doesn't control the participants, teachers run amok, students run amok, and shitposters. (tell me if i missed one)

While punishment in RP is good, it has a chance to stir up drama like the following.

Mr. Bob: Timmy, you have now been expelled!
Timmy: ((wtf i didnt do anything you're shitty lmao)
Jimmy ((yeah timmy's right you suck lOL))
And so on, so on. Of course, it could be as small as that or it could be big scale drama where most of the rpers are ganging up on the one person, harrassing them, even.

So if that won't work, what will?

That's up to you. While trying to derail the RP could become a mutable offense, that might work. However, there's possibly some better ways to do this.

For now, I'll drop off these things.

  • Giving out teachers to trusted people only. This is part of the problem, as your teachers are technically your co-hosts. They can either advance the RP smoothly, or burn it the ground.

  • If there's shitposting and stuff, don't join it just because the people doing it are your friends. I've done it before, and it just leads you getting muted.

  • Try to expand! Don't just limit students to going through all the classes, there's more! Make up events, do afterschool activites! Take your students on field trips!
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Re: A Post-Mortem of Prom and Saving PokeHigh: Why Do These RPs Have Stigmas?

Post by Marshall De Vos on Sun Sep 04, 2016 5:18 am

I'm honest.
I only know one Pokéhigh doc that hasn't gone downhill because of the general quality of RPing in the RP, and that's Yujo's. I know more people worked on it, don't feel ignored, I just want to address it by the doc owner's name. :i ( I can't speak for docs I haven't seen running, like Ryan's. )

Though what irks me most about Pokéhigh, is this. I don't hate on any kind of RP, don't get me wrong. There are just some RPs I don't like joining, or have to see them run first before joining.

I cannot overcome myself to join any Pokéhigh RPs anymore.

I've tried. I've tried to set up a bit of RPing inside it aswell. I have never been joined seriously in all the times I've tried. In the later stages of me joining, I actually started to be GLAD when someone in-RP merely greeted my characters, considering others, who don't put ( I'm not trying to insult people in general here, so sorry if this comes out wrongly ) detail into their RPing and just get flocked to like a swarm of Pidgey flocks to Pokéblocks. I'm not even going to go into detail about general hosting quality and RPer control or I'll just turn this into a rant that's going to send me to notol.

If people were to at least try and bring up some of the suggestions made here, I might reconsider myself. Though as of now, I've pretty much forsaken Pokéhigh. One diamond in the rough isn't worth digging through figurative tons of dirt in my eyes.
Until then.
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Re: A Post-Mortem of Prom and Saving PokeHigh: Why Do These RPs Have Stigmas?

Post by MightyenaBoy on Mon Sep 05, 2016 1:32 pm

My main issue with Pokehigh at the given moment (or any Roleplay, really.) is that people are voting for lower quality hosts simply because 'Im used to this person/this person is popular so I'll vote for them'. This has been seen in pretty much any Roleplay that has a host poll. People vote for the popular option because they feel like it's safe to do so.

Nobody looks at documents anymore, they simply judge by the name or by the user attempting to host. The idea of looking at documents has to be enforced before we can even think about improving Pokehigh (or other hosted RPs) quality.

In short, please stop voting for 'popular people' just because you're used to them. Give other people a chance and I'm sure that they'll outshine who you think was the best of the best.

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Re: A Post-Mortem of Prom and Saving PokeHigh: Why Do These RPs Have Stigmas?

Post by Rico on Mon Sep 05, 2016 3:01 pm

I'm going to counter that by saying a popular person is generally a safer bet. If an RP only happens 4 or 5 times a week, do you want to chance it with the unknown, or go with someone you believe is going to do the best job.

In short, vote for people who are popular for hosting enjoyable RPs, or being good RPers in general. That's exactly why we have the vote system in place, so that good hosts can become popular and hopefully be the only hosts we have.

"But Rico what about new hosts?" ask to co-host, or just RP in the room a whole bunch. Build your reputation before hosting, not after.
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